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Board index Discussion News

Eternal-WoW Survey Results

Topic locked Rate Topic: Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average. • 76 posts • Page 2 of 4 1, 2, 3, 4
#21 Fri Jun 30, 2017 3:02 pm by Evgeniya
Here's a perfect example of the biggest problem with Eternal-WoW staff.

At the moment when i was ported out of the event i asked in /world why i was removed and said that i didn't forfeit, nobody answered. 40 minutes later this genius answers my ticket.

Image

After this the GM person closed the ticket and went offline or whatever.

A general lack of competence, both from the event GMs and this Biohamster person. This is not how you do customer service, and not how you run events.
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#22 Fri Jun 30, 2017 4:47 pm by Diethylamidex
Clismore2 wrote:If you require us to name this person in particular, because you can't infer it, then I have to say I don't think you've been engaged enough with the staff in past to be at the forefront of tackling such issues. I'm not denigrating the forum mod team, however by and large they always were relatively autonomous and unaffected by the rest of staff.

I'd wager that most of us replying here were on staff at one point or another. I can only be thankful that the donation team had an admin who was at least outwardly professional.

I know the person you're speaking of, it's just that I want people to be honest and let out what they think. I can only be so direct with my words, without it seeming as though I am accusing a fellow staff member. The community shouldn't be afraid of retribution if, they're giving constructive criticism. I wish to encourage free speech, the past corruption, bias and denial is inexcusable.

Evgeniya wrote:Here's a perfect example of the biggest problem with Eternal-WoW staff.

At the moment when i was ported out of the event i asked in /world why i was removed and said that i didn't forfeit, nobody answered. 40 minutes later this genius answers my ticket.

Image

After this the GM person closed the ticket and went offline or whatever.

A general lack of competence, both from the event GMs and this Biohamster person. This is not how you do customer service, and not how you run events.

This will be dealt with, we take these claims very seriously. Thank you for posting this.

Have a great day everyone,
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#23 Fri Jun 30, 2017 5:11 pm by gardio1234
Clismore2 wrote:I'm neither Nost nor Pow, sorry.
Those two people didn't even come into my mind. It was Vermilion I was thinking of - but whether or not it is actually you, you deeply remind me of him in a good way. Good times.

Shame I likely never got to know you, you seem like a decent individual.
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#24 Fri Jun 30, 2017 7:11 pm by flyinglemmings
    Dear all,

    I am happy that the CM is doing a great job communicating with the community. It is one of our first steps in our strive to better and improve our staff. As we continually work towards our goals, we appreciate and value the continuous communication between the players and staff.

    As CM Diethylamidex said in his earlier post, we will follow up with the issue and speak with the GM team to ensure our communication with the players is at a level we are satisfied with.

    We will always value comments from the community and conduct our own investigation/inquiry into our policies and procedures that may be affected. However, the staff will make decisions that the senior staff feels is in the best interest of the server.

    From the last senior staff meeting, we are optimistic in helping each other on staff improve - in order to meet our players' expectations. Not only are our Senior GMs maintaining and implementing new standard controls, the administration is also working to rectify past issues. I am pleasantly pleased with the drive these individuals have shown and I am sure great things will come from them in the future.

    Kind regards,
    Donation Admin Flyinglemmings
    Eternal-WoW Donation/Management Team

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#25 Sat Jul 01, 2017 2:48 am by Smilindeath
Hello there,
I was one of the assistants at the event, my job was picking competitors for the event matches, Although after the quarter finals i started to lag heavily - as in everything i do was delayed for literally 1 - 2 minute to actually happen in-game - (it was a ddos), i had the groups open and organized as to who won his second match (qualified for semi - finals). The event was relatively small , and it was my bad that assumed the other GM assisting with me was well aware of the groups as there was only 2 groups left to deal with, thats after i got completely disconnected and my internet was just dead by then, while this is happening i kept trying to log in-game (my bad that i just didnt inform the GM hosting the event on discord as text msg) , and it worked for once but with the absolute ultra lag possible, and realized that "Lichmy" was kicked and i saw the final match happening, i tried to ask who did this character lose to but didnt get an answer as the GMs were busy dealing with the last match, unaware that a mistake might have been made.

My apologies dear Evgeniya, as to it was a mistake in the job i had to do, but couldnt really fix the internet issue at that time. And i hope our higher Staff team see this, and give you a deserved reward for your time and effort in that event as you qualified to the after semi-finals and had a high chance to win it.
Last edited by Smilindeath on Sat Jul 01, 2017 7:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
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#26 Sat Jul 01, 2017 7:21 am by Kredenaz
    Hi there,

    I am here to apologize in the name of entire GM team. I also assure you that the issue was dealt with and fitting punishment was given out. Furthermore I will be giving you a small reward in game, as a token of apology.

    On the other hand, I will be speaking with Super GMs later today and assure that they host proper events, without any mistakes in the future.

    Once again, my earnest apology to everyone involved.

    Kind Regards,
    Senior GM Kredenaz.
    Eternal-WoW Staff.
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#27 Sat Jul 01, 2017 8:37 am by Clismore2
gardio1234 wrote:
Clismore2 wrote:I'm neither Nost nor Pow, sorry.
Those two people didn't even come into my mind. It was Vermilion I was thinking of - but whether or not it is actually you, you deeply remind me of him in a good way. Good times.

Shame I likely never got to know you, you seem like a decent individual.


I'm disgusted that you'd compare me to that philistine.

Having said that, yes. Yes, I am a decent individual, if I do say so myself.

I'd like to level a question to the GM team. What sort of punishments are meted out on those who transgress the rules of the GM team? What can a rule-breaker expect to receive, apart from a talking to that one might consider stern on a good day.
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#28 Sat Jul 01, 2017 8:48 am by Evgeniya
Clismore2 wrote:I'd like to level a question to the GM team. What sort of punishments are meted out on those who transgress the rules of the GM team? What can a rule-breaker expect to receive, apart from a talking to that one might consider stern on a good day.



I assume their weekly salary is yoinked.
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#29 Sat Jul 01, 2017 9:38 am by kriken
Clismore2 wrote:Yes, I am a decent individual, if I do say so myself.


Before, during or after you abuse staff members :)
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#30 Sat Jul 01, 2017 11:49 pm by Clismore2
Evgeniya wrote:
Clismore2 wrote:I'd like to level a question to the GM team. What sort of punishments are meted out on those who transgress the rules of the GM team? What can a rule-breaker expect to receive, apart from a talking to that one might consider stern on a good day.



I assume their weekly salary is yoinked.


The problem with GM pay is that the pay grades for each rating out of ten are too linear. There is a poor incentive to get a higher rating, especially when high ratings are doled out like candy. A week's pay for a GM is fairly paltry, regardless.

kriken wrote:
Clismore2 wrote:Yes, I am a decent individual, if I do say so myself.


Before, during or after you abuse staff members :)


I am the personal embodiment of karma. If I abuse staff members, it means the universe hates them, and they had it coming. 8)
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#31 Sun Jul 02, 2017 1:49 am by gardio1234
Clismore2 wrote:The problem with GM pay is that the pay grades for each rating out of ten are too linear. There is a poor incentive to get a higher rating, especially when high ratings are doled out like candy. A week's pay for a GM is fairly paltry, regardless.
My deepest apologies for this huge wall of text that you are likely about to venture into, I have put it in spoiler marks so it doesn't cover up too much. Read at your own discretion. It's my opinion on the matter after 3 years in and out of the GM team, take it all as feedback or even possible criticism. It's about 2000 words total, sorry.

Spoiler: show
2-5$ a week (in VIP points) for voting almost every day and working a minimum of 10 hours a week, typically 15-60+ hours for any high rank GMs. Where their rewards are maybe 5-7$ a week in VIP points nonetheless, the amount builds up over time if you save and use your VIP points carefully - but it's still a ridiculously low amount in comparison to the amount of work. However, it's better than nothing so it's bearable. And this is how Eternal has always been and likely always will be like until its demise.

Albeit it is indeed a paltry amount, and many have tried arguing or urging for it to be increased in the past to increase motivation for GMs, but motivation through external influences like VIP points isn't what Eternal wants. They want someone that just does it purely for the community and not just for VIP points, that is understandable and I agree with this on a personal level. But it honestly doesn't seem realistic to expect this kind of mindless devotion from staff any longer - especially not when they start running into issues with quality and shortage of staff members. That's when they should start expanding their minds and tipping their hands into areas which they previously wouldn't consider due to there not being a real need for it.

I remember suggesting in the past to decrease the minimum work time requirement to 7 hours - to make it easier, as 10 hours a week is an uneven number of 1 hour and 20 minutes a day - whereas 7 hours a week is very simple to understand as a minimum requirement. Just log on and do your GM work for one hour a day. In addition to potentially increasing GM rewards, not by an absurd amount - but at least increasing it incrementally and introducing rewards that would further reward creativity and hard-work, because as is - there is no incentive to do anything besides the promotions and out of free good will for the community. I remember being a Senior GM and had a lot of high quality GMs I didn't want to let go - that kept getting 7-8 hours due to lack of time. However, I was ultimately left with no choice after a month or so of repeated failure to meet the minimum requirement. The only ones left were the incredibly rare who had both quality and quantity who typically climbed the ranks like a professional rock climber, and others who barely met the quality requirement but had insane amounts of quantity. Today, in our current staff team - we have some who don't even meet the quality requirement. But provide such astounding amounts of quantity that due to shortage of staff and work piling that we are almost left with no choice but to use this guy as he is a literal one man army and can do the work of a dozen GMs all by himself.

The promotions typically go like this from what I have seen:
Moderator > GM - 1 week - you have to pass the trial, meaning you'll have to meet the basic requirement. Okay quality, and meeting the minimum requirement in addition to having an amount of tickets that leads us to believe you actually were doing tickets and not just sitting there all day long.

GM to Super GM - anywhere from 2 weeks if circumstances need it including the fact you meet the requirements already to the typical two months if you have reasonable quality and quantity, to even longer if need be. I remember a GM taking almost a year to become a Super GM once, it isn't black and white - this is just what is typical from what I have seen.

Super GM to Senior GM - anywhere from 2 weeks to half a year, sometimes it doesn't matter how well you do if we have enough Seniors and/or you do not meet the Leadership requirement.

Senior GM > Admin Assistant = A clear spot must be available for Admin Assistant, you must have proved you're useful and loyal - have a somewhat clear record with good leadership and compatibility (means Management has to like you on an almost personal level) with the other Admins. The time it takes to even be considered for this promotion? Usually a year of consistent work +- as a Senior.

Admin Assistant > Admin: A few months long trial - and sometimes they even have no intention of ever letting you have Admin, for the simple reason another Admin doesn't like you that much after you got Admin Assistant. But they feel reluctant to demote or remove you, therefore they put you at a standstill - where you're between the Senior rank and the Admin rank. Because if anyone who has spent several months as a Senior GM finally receives a promotion to Admin Assistant is put back to Senior GM - they have a tendency to just straight give up and lose absolutely all motivation within the span of a week. That's just how demotions tend to go around here, it's a voluntary position after all - and more responsibility is enjoyable, so being demoted means less fun.

The point being with all of this is once you reach Senior GM, there really isn't any incentive to keep working besides just general management experience and an incredibly small amount of virtual currency of which you likely have no use since you barely get to play the game anyway. Motivation becomes an all-time low at some points and you run through pure discipline, which admittedly most people won't have for that long in addition to voluntarily spending dozens of hours a week to keep the GM team in check. They will lose interest, the work will go over to the Admins and the Admins will find another Senior GM and fire or demote the current one for inactivity. This cycle repeats itself endlessly, it's just the way it is. So how does this relate to everything I said? Well, put quite simply... you need to use the carrot and stick not just on the grunt workers - but on the ones supervising the grunt workers too. For example do you have a clear talk with the Senior GMs about the possibilities of a promotion towards a higher rank, what they need to improve on - a time line of how long it will take before you feel they are ready for more responsibilities? No, you do not. The Senior GM rank will look like the ceiling of the ladder that they can climb, no further than this can you go - and the amount of lazy Senior GMs I have seen is astoundingly high for this exact reason. They don't see the point, doing this work that doesn't provide that much stimuli and becomes old after 3-4 months of repetition. They crave something new - you need to provide them that something and it doesn't have to be a promotion, nor does it have to be VIP points. Sometimes they find it themselves and run through pure discipline until they eventually reach the Admin rank, is this really the way it is supposed to be? I remember being told of old times when Senior GMs were promoted within the span of a couple of months with a clear line of progression up the ranks. A Staff Admin, Manager - everything. I have seen about two Seniors be promoted to Admin the past 3 years and the two of them were Seniors for many years. Two?! Do you know how many Seniors we have had in these 3 years? 20-30, I would say, minimum. Most of this was venting, but I hope you understand how frustrating it can be from a Senior's perspective.

The reward suggestions
As things were though it might no longer be this way due to being out of date- but GMs did significantly more grunt work and put in far more hours than many of the other departments. Yet they were most of the time actually even paid less in VIP points. I don't believe it to be this way any longer, though - but it was this way for a very, very long time. Example: A forum Moderator would put in maybe 6 hours a week and get 3000 VIP points on his End of the Month reward, whereas a GM would put in 30 hours a week and get 2500 VIP points. I am sure you can see what is wrong with this? Most GMs were kept ignorant of this fact, but as a Supervisor - being aware that the rewards were like this for so long made me lose a lot of faith in the Management very early on due to the unfairness of it all, and the fact they used the same reward system for GMs and Forum Moderators yet had different concepts for how much effort and time each position required. Having a clear double standard in the ratio of how much each staff member was paid in comparison to the quality and quantity of their work.

But a big issue at hand has always been motivation, and rewards are known for increasing motivation and giving people incentive to stay longer and be more loyal. Thus I want you to at least read some of my suggestions and take them into consideration - perhaps bring it up in a potential meeting, bringing up the pros and cons. In addition to what is possible, what is not possible. I don't expect you to give a ridiculous amount away to your staff members all of a sudden. But there should be more levels and progression, giving them a clear goal to work towards more than just promotions and their basic work. Something on the side to further motivate them, micro-goals, and maybe a stronger reward for loyalty and consistency?

Suggestion 1)
The suggestion was basically to introduce something more incremental - such as work consistency levels, that would increase your rewards by a certain percentage for your consistency. Hint: Weeklies and not just quantity, but also quality should be taken into consideration. The sad reality however is that rewards are almost purely based on quantity, and quality rewards are very difficult to keep track of for a myriad of reasons.

Suggestion 2)
Test quality more often and come up with random bonuses in reward for impressive quality, try to test quality for each staff member regularly and evenly each week. This is a tremendous amount of extra work for the supervisors, but it would truly help the entire staff team as a whole, would it not? The bonus doesn't have to be anything significant, but it could be an added on bonus to your current reward, a meager additional amount like 200-400 VIP points. The extra bonus effect would be extra effort from the staff in putting in more effort into each ticket or public forum post.

Suggestion 3)
Set incremental goals: Reach this amount of tickets this week with your quality being monitored at all times through an Add-On that keeps track of all logs and is simple and easy to simply upload and let your supervisors go through. Show a clear line of progression, work with them on their quality, guide them - along with rewards for clear improvements in quality. Do not show bias towards the ones that don't seem to need help with progression, though - a system should be in place that rewards these people, too - because that is the end goal of this.
Last edited by gardio1234 on Sun Jul 02, 2017 10:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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#32 Sun Jul 02, 2017 9:35 am by souchiro1
gardio1234 wrote:
Clismore2 wrote:The problem with GM pay is that the pay grades for each rating out of ten are too linear. There is a poor incentive to get a higher rating, especially when high ratings are doled out like candy. A week's pay for a GM is fairly paltry, regardless.
My deepest apologies for this huge wall of text that you are likely about to venture into, I have put it in spoiler marks so it doesn't cover up too much. Read at your own discretion. It's my opinion on the matter after 3 years in and out of the GM team, take it all as feedback or even possible criticism. It's about 2000 words total, sorry.

Spoiler: show
2-5$ a week (in VIP points) for voting almost every day and working a minimum of 10 hours a week, typically 15-60+ hours for any high rank GMs. Where their rewards are maybe 5-7$ a week in VIP points nonetheless, the amount builds up over time if you save and use your VIP points carefully - but it's still a ridiculously low amount in comparison to the amount of work. However, it's better than nothing so it's bearable. And this is how Eternal has always been and likely always will be like until its demise.

Albeit it is indeed a paltry amount, and many have tried arguing or urging for it to be increased in the past to increase motivation for GMs, but motivation through external influences like VIP points isn't what Eternal wants. They want someone that just does it purely for the community and not just for VIP points, that is understandable and I agree with this on a personal level. But it honestly doesn't seem realistic to expect this kind of mindless devotion from staff any longer - especially not when they start running into issues with quality and shortage of staff members. That's when they should start expanding their minds and tipping their hands into areas which they previously wouldn't consider due to there not being a real need for it.

I remember suggesting in the past to decrease the minimum work time requirement to 7 hours - to make it easier, as 10 hours a week is an uneven number of 1 hour and 20 minutes a day - whereas 7 hours a week is very simple to understand as a minimum requirement. Just log on and do your GM work for one hour a day. In addition to potentially increasing GM rewards, not by an absurd amount - but at least increasing it incrementally and introducing rewards that would further reward creativity and hard-work, because as is - there is no incentive to do anything besides the promotions and out of free good will for the community. I remember being a Senior GM and had a lot of high quality GMs I didn't want to let go - that kept getting 7-8 hours due to lack of time. However, I was ultimately left with no choice after a month or so of repeated failure to meet the minimum requirement. The only ones left were the incredibly rare who had both quality and quantity who typically climbed the ranks like a professional rock climber, and others who barely met the quality requirement but had insane amounts of quantity. Today, in our current staff team - we have some who don't even meet the quality requirement. But provide such astounding amounts of quantity that due to shortage of staff and work piling that we are almost left with no choice but to use this guy as he is a literal one man army and can do the work of a dozen GMs all by himself.

The promotions typically go like this from what I have seen:
Moderator > GM - 1 week - you have to pass the trial, meaning you'll have to meet the basic requirement. Okay quality, and meeting the minimum requirement in addition to having an amount of tickets that leads us to believe you actually were doing tickets and not just sitting there all day long.

GM to Super GM - anywhere from 2 weeks if circumstances need it including the fact you meet the requirements already to the typical two months if you have reasonable quality and quantity, to even longer if need be. I remember a GM taking almost a year to become a Super GM once, it isn't black and white - this is just what is typical from what I have seen.

Super GM to Senior GM - anywhere from 2 weeks to half a year, sometimes it doesn't matter how well you do if we have enough Seniors and/or you do not meet the Leadership requirement.

Senior GM > Admin Assistant = A clear spot must be available for Admin Assistant, you must have proved you're useful and loyal - have a somewhat clear record with good leadership and compatibility (means Management has to like you on an almost personal level) with the other Admins. The time it takes to even be considered for this promotion? Usually a year of consistent work +- as a Senior.

Admin Assistant > Admin: A few months long trial - and sometimes they even have no intention of ever letting you have Admin, for the simple reason another Admin doesn't like you that much after you got Admin Assistant. But they feel reluctant to demote or remove you, therefore they put you at a standstill - where you're between the Senior rank and the Admin rank. Because if anyone who has spent several months as a Senior GM finally receives a promotion to Admin Assistant is put back to Senior GM - they have a tendency to just straight give up and lose absolutely all motivation within the span of a week. That's just how demotions tend to go around here, it's a voluntary position after all - and more responsibility is enjoyable, so being demoted means less fun.

The point being with all of this is once you reach Senior GM, there really isn't any incentive to keep working besides just general management experience and an incredibly small amount of virtual currency of which you likely have no use since you barely get to play the game anyway. Motivation becomes an all-time low at some points and you run through pure discipline, which admittedly most people won't have for that long in addition to voluntarily spending dozens of hours a week to keep the GM team in check. They will lose interest, the work will go over to the Admins and the Admins will find another Senior GM and fire or demote the current one for inactivity. This cycle repeats itself endlessly, it's just the way it is. So how does this relate to everything I said? Well, put quite simply... you need to use the carrot and stick not just on the grunt workers - but on the ones supervising the grunt workers too. For example do you have a clear talk with the Senior GMs about the possibilities of a promotion towards a higher rank, what they need to improve on - a time line of how long it will take before you feel they are ready for more responsibilities? No, you do not. The Senior GM rank will look like the ceiling of the ladder that they can climb, no further than this can you go - and the amount of lazy Senior GMs I have seen is astoundingly high for this exact reason. They don't see the point, doing this work that doesn't provide that much stimuli and becomes old after 3-4 months of repetition. They crave something new - you need to provide them that something and it doesn't have to be a promotion, nor does it have to be VIP points. Sometimes they find it themselves and run through pure discipline until they eventually reach the Admin rank, is this really the way it is supposed to be? I remember being told of old times when Senior GMs were promoted within the span of a couple of months with a clear line of progression up the ranks. A Staff Admin, Manager - everything. I have seen about two Seniors be promoted to Admin the past 3 years and the two of them were Seniors for many years. Two?! Do you know how many Seniors we have had in these 3 years? 20-30, I would say, minimum. Most of this was venting, but I hope you understand how frustrating it can be from a Senior's perspective.

The reward suggestions
As things were though it might no longer be this way due to lack of information - but GMs did significantly more grunt work and put in far more hours than many of the other departments. Yet they were most of the time actually even paid less in VIP points. I don't believe it to be this way any longer, though - but it was this way for a very, very long time. Example: A forum Moderator would put in maybe 6 hours a week and get 3000 VIP points on his End of the Month reward, whereas a GM would put in 30 hours a week and get 2500 VIP points. I am sure you can see what is wrong with this? Most GMs were kept ignorant of this fact, but as a Supervisor - being aware that the rewards were like this for so long made me lose a lot of faith in the Management very early on due to the unfairness of it all, and the fact they used the same reward system for GMs and Forum Moderators yet had different concepts for how much effort and time each position required. Having a clear double standard in the ratio of how much each staff member was paid in comparison to the quality and quantity of their work.

But a big issue at hand has always been motivation, and rewards are known for increasing motivation and giving people incentive to stay longer and be more loyal. Thus I want you to at least read some of my suggestions and take them into consideration - perhaps bring it up in a potential meeting, bringing up the pros and cons. In addition to what is possible, what is not possible. I don't expect you to give a ridiculous amount away to your staff members all of a sudden. But there should be more levels and progression, giving them a clear goal to work towards more than just promotions and their basic work. Something on the side to further motivate them, micro-goals, and maybe a stronger reward for loyalty and consistency?

Suggestion 1)
The suggestion was basically to introduce something more incremental - such as work consistency levels, that would increase your rewards by a certain percentage for your consistency. Hint: Weeklies and not just quantity, but also quality should be taken into consideration. The sad reality however is that rewards are almost purely based on quantity, and quality rewards are very difficult to keep track of for a myriad of reasons.

Suggestion 2)
Test quality more often and come up with random bonuses in reward for impressive quality, try to test quality for each staff member regularly and evenly each week. This is a tremendous amount of extra work for the supervisors, but it would truly help the entire staff team as a whole, would it not? The bonus doesn't have to be anything significant, but it could be an added on bonus to your current reward, a meager additional amount like 200-400 VIP points. The extra bonus effect would be extra effort from the staff in putting in more effort into each ticket or public forum post.

Suggestion 3)
Set incremental goals: Reach this amount of tickets this week with your quality being monitored at all times through an Add-On that keeps track of all logs and is simple and easy to simply upload and let your supervisors go through. Show a clear line of progression, work with them on their quality, guide them - along with rewards for clear improvements in quality. Do not show bias towards the ones that don't seem to need help with progression, though - a system should be in place that rewards these people, too - because that is the end goal of this.


Thats is the basic definition and impact of capitalism and corporation systems that we sadly are even stuck on in real life, people just got used to it and forgot whats important (e.g, justice , being fair , not being cheap / greedy and selfish , etc etc etc). Despite all this deep talk, i actually enjoy (or atleast use to) playing on server cuz some og friends i have in, etc etc.
I admire the provide of such fun way to kill time in from the owner, but a little bit unsure of his intentions as im in no place to judge (regarding the corporation way of thinking), but assuming after a short experience on the GM team and what you said , that he just belongs to that way of thinking, it is his right , but hes just dragging (maybe abusing) a number of people (but for the admins) into a non ethical way of Work (very low paycheck in virtual currency, as you have mentioned and i have experienced) with no real motivation etc etc.

Anyway, all that i believe is that the staff team is actually trying hard (absolutely nonsense methods for the situation the server is actually in) to "improve" the server for the 50 players online ,which is okay in the eye of the owner because hes actually making a living out of it, but not okay for players (which i am pretty much sure they share this opinion with me) to just see the server dying and dying -which is a bummer- and not noticing that whatever they are doing is actually wrong, im not sure if it is a desperate try to prove something for themselves or the higher ranked staff, but either way it is obviously not working, as i been playing here on eternal realm mostly, and recently almost dont get a 2vs2 queue in a week long phase.

I thought i would just voice my opinion on whats happening, hopefully someone wakes up, but i doubt it really. Cheers, stay dope.
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#33 Sun Jul 02, 2017 10:51 am by gardio1234
souchiro1 wrote:
Thats is the basic definition and impact of capitalism and corporation systems that we sadly are even stuck on in real life, people just got used to it and forgot whats important (e.g, justice , being fair , not being cheap / greedy and selfish , etc etc etc). Despite all this deep talk, i actually enjoy (or atleast use to) playing on server cuz some og friends i have in, etc etc.
I admire the provide of such fun way to kill time in from the owner, but a little bit unsure of his intentions as im in no place to judge (regarding the corporation way of thinking), but assuming after a short experience on the GM team and what you said , that he just belongs to that way of thinking, it is his right , but hes just dragging (maybe abusing) a number of people (but for the admins) into a non ethical way of Work (very low paycheck in virtual currency, as you have mentioned and i have experienced) with no real motivation etc etc.

Anyway, all that i believe is that the staff team is actually trying hard (absolutely nonsense methods for the situation the server is actually in) to "improve" the server for the 50 players online ,which is okay in the eye of the owner because hes actually making a living out of it, but not okay for players (which i am pretty much sure they share this opinion with me) to just see the server dying and dying -which is a bummer- and not noticing that whatever they are doing is actually wrong, im not sure if it is a desperate try to prove something for themselves or the higher ranked staff, but either way it is obviously not working, as i been playing here on eternal realm mostly, and recently almost dont get a 2vs2 queue in a week long phase.

I thought i would just voice my opinion on whats happening, hopefully someone wakes up, but i doubt it really. Cheers, stay dope.
I would say the way to run a business or corporation can be done in many different ways, and since Eternal-WoW isn't exactly heading in the right direction. Maybe it's time to try something else for a change? It's a private server with a community and a player-base, of course. Why would you view it as a corporation - what sort of benefit would that merit you besides money? From the top of my head, a corporation is basically something that doesn't need to be greedy, but in reality, is.

Well, you cannot say Cyph3r didn't see it coming. After all, he had plenty of warnings beforehand, and people even approached him and told him this was going to happen eventually if he didn't change his ways or his mindset. I was personally one of these people at one point - but I was brushed off and simply told I was mistaken, he quite obviously put a distance towards Eternal-WoW and mostly let it run autonomously with help from the "Management" for micro-management. Not ever making any significant changes due to being afraid of repercussions or taking risks for the better good of the community. I have to admit this isn't why the player-base died exactly, there were many reasons. But this right here? This corporation and capitalistic mindset? It did indeed slowly kill the player spirit, and even some people's faith in Eternal-WoW permanently over time. Eternal had its run, and maybe - just maybe, it will be prolonged due to some miracle occurring, god knows. But we surely need some sort of miracle for this ship to keep sailing. The most major setbacks were when most of the great old veteran developers quit, the big hack screwing Eternal-WoW over - the drama and loss of the large social medias. Last but not least - failure to invest properly to make up for your losses, especially when it came to hiring Developers that's what hit the player-base the most. When Eternal-WoW started falling further and further behind in game-development in comparison to our competitors. There's a reason why Remorse is the most popular and successful realm right now, whereas in the past - it was moreso Redemption or Eternal. Because it's a custom server, and even then - our competitors are now one-upping us even here. We're just falling behind and becoming old news.

Eternal-WoW is rank 23 on XtremeTop100, in addition it isn't even a premium member any longer. Oh boy. Scratch miracle, we need a literal demi-god to descend on this planet and produce a real life miracle. Jokes aside, there still is a possibility for Eternal-WoW to get through this and maybe even grow its player-base although the odds are against us at this point in time and might remain this way for the foreseeable future.
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#34 Sun Jul 02, 2017 11:31 am by souchiro1
Money? it is literally impossible for me to get actual "money" anyhow in this situation whatsoever, so thats not point. I think my point was clear to the ones related if they ever read it.

Anyway, youre right, literally almost a miracle. During my time on staff, i worked hard (no one can deny that), and on the side , i really honestly try to implement a small change that i thought it would be a start for a change, instead of the latest changes that gets the situation even more boring, more precisely, being 100% "professional" which in my mind set is absolutely totally useless, ATLEAST in the current situation, if you wana think about it that way, but ofc i was bugged and misunderstood by it both from the staff and few players,but cant blame them anyway, they need to feed their ego with whatever possible way they see its convincing, even if it is out of the world wrong, they are only humans at the end and we come in different mindsets naturally.



Peace and love. Make eternal great again.
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#35 Sun Jul 02, 2017 1:24 pm by gardio1234
souchiro1 wrote:Money? it is literally impossible for me to get actual "money" anyhow in this situation whatsoever, so thats not point. I think my point was clear to the ones related if they ever read it.

Anyway, youre right, literally almost a miracle. During my time on staff, i worked hard (no one can deny that), and on the side , i really honestly try to implement a small change that i thought it would be a start for a change, instead of the latest changes that gets the situation even more boring, more precisely, being 100% "professional" which in my mind set is absolutely totally useless, ATLEAST in the current situation, if you wana think about it that way, but ofc i was bugged and misunderstood by it both from the staff and few players,but cant blame them anyway, they need to feed their ego with whatever possible way they see its convincing, even if it is out of the world wrong, they are only humans at the end and we come in different mindsets naturally.



Peace and love. Make eternal great again.
Corporations tend to maximize profits above all else. Doesn't that seem somewhat like what Eternal is doing although not completely, obviously? That's my point, not the GM's reason for being here being money, that should be quite obvious by now. It's well known they're paid bread crumbs for their work. Game Masters are typically here for the new experience of being a GM, or simply because they enjoy the responsibility or would possibly even like to help out the community.

But what's the end goal of Eternal-WoW really? Of course that is a private emulation of World of Warcraft, with donation shops to fund the server funds, that's something everyone knows. Bills truly don't pay themselves. However, what keeps Cyph3r running Eternal-WoW as a side-project for so long during all this time? Is it really just passion for the game or are there meager profits to gain on the side from all of this?
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#36 Mon Jul 03, 2017 7:12 pm by flyrice604
If you guys don't get rid of that one GM that is the cancer of this server then you guys are either blind or saying all this 'make Eternal great again' bs just to try and win back players. That GM's gotta go. We all know who he is. Yeah, the dude with the cocky attitude. If he's still here then trust me this server is not going anywhere.


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#37 Tue Jul 04, 2017 12:25 pm by DragonScales
flyrice604 wrote:If you guys don't get rid of that one GM that is the cancer of this server then you guys are either blind or saying all this 'make Eternal great again' bs just to try and win back players. That GM's gotta go. We all know who he is. Yeah, the dude with the cocky attitude. If he's still here then trust me this server is not going anywhere.


That one gm uhh ok


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#40 Fri Jul 07, 2017 12:30 am by gargletide
I do have a question: is anything going to be done about the internal atmosphere and treatment of the staff team?

When I was a GM, it was not very good. The higher level GMs would constantly dog you to be online more, with norespect for the GMs circumstances - even if you were active 6-7 hours a day. GMs weren't really allowed to play, or if they did, it was essentially supervised (you had to get permission, and if you didn't you'd be shit on for it during internal reviews), further creating a risk of burn out. There was also a lot of internal politics, with internal feedback essentially being discarded no matter how valid or relevant it may be - I actually saw senior staff laughing at some of it at one point. The lack of internal respect for staff was (and from what I've heard, still is) an issue just as much as GM behaviors are to players.

All of that is why I decided to resign, it was horrible. No matter how professional or well you did, you were basically treated like an object for the seniors to wring work out of, and often treated like dirt. Don't get me wrong, GMs are there to help folks as well as moderate, but the environment should be friendly and the senior staff should be flexible. That simply wasn't the case.


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